Ask A Pro!: Reverse Engineering: Plan Your Career with the End in Mind - Special Guest Bez Rengifo

Unlock the secrets to a thriving career with insights from Bez Rengifo, a recruitment visionary, who joined us to share his expertise on how personal connections can triumph over formal job applications.

Our conversation with Bez is more than just a chat; it's a treasure trove of unconventional career wisdom and a testament to the power of networking.

Prepare to bolster your career mindset and learn strategies to navigate high-pressure scenarios like never before. We disentangle the complexities of cultivating a positive outlook, particularly when facing stressful situations such as job interviews.

This episode is a call to action for intentional career and life design. We discussed the importance of aligning your career trajectory with your life goals, and sharing personal strategies that have stood the test of time.

We touch on the power of interviewing potential employers with purpose and the crucial nature of regular check-ins with your boss. Bez enhances the discourse with his insights, emphasizing the value of proactivity in career advancement.

Connect with Bez on LinkedIn, give us your thoughts, and be part of the conversation that shapes our journey forward. Join us next week for more guidance on redefining your professional path.

Bez Rengifo
https://www.linkedin.com/in/bezrengifo/

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Transcript

Mary Fain Brandt: 0:02

Welcome to the Redefine Your Career Journey Podcast, where we help career minded professionals like you become the CEO of your career.

Laura Bashore: 0:11

I'm Laura Bashore and I'm here with my co-host, Mary Fain Brandt. Together, we have over 25 years of experience in career development and coaching.

Mary Fain Brandt: 0:19

We're thrilled to share our insights and expertise with you on this podcast.

Laura Bashore: 0:22

Grab your favorite cup of coffee, tune in and let's start the show. I want to say one more thing about your fabulous menu, which is not only do we love coffee together, but I saw that you had French 75s on there. It's my favorite drink, except for I do French 76, which is just vodka instead of gin, and so this is why we are one.

Mary Fain Brandt: 0:48

This is why we yes, we work so well Coffee and cocktails, but let's get to the show, laura. We have an amazing guest. Bez Renjifo is joining us today and he was on our LinkedIn audio event, but I want to share the story about how Bez and I met. We met on LinkedIn, so plug again for LinkedIn, you guys. It is an amazing platform where you get to connect with other professionals and grow your network and learn, and Bez was actually one of the panelists on my online summit that I did, I think, in 2021.

Mary Fain Brandt: 1:27

Yeah, so he came on because I was following him. I'm like who's the guy that keeps commenting on all of my posts on LinkedIn? I was like who's Bez? He's got over 25 years of experience in the recruiting industry, and one of the things I really love about Bez, though, is his love to support the community, whether it's an online community or whether it's in person, and right now, I saw Bez that he is supporting the Make a Wish Foundation by doing a 22 mile walk, so we will ask him about that later. How are you doing today, bez?

Bez Rengifo: 2:07

Hey, I'm doing fantastic. Thank you for the invite, laura and Mary. I'm big fans of your podcast and I am your brand fan, so I think now we're friends, right.

Laura Bashore: 2:20

We've moved to the friendship category. I mean, I was so happy to have you join us today because I loved our conversations Back when Mary and I were doing the LinkedIn audio live events you know the Bez show, which is how I met you and so I'm just thrilled that our new or our returning audience is going to be able to share from you today and help you share a little bit about what you do on our podcast. So why don't we start with you telling our audience about your own career journey?

Bez Rengifo: 2:54

Well, you know, there's a saying that says Mamas, don't let your boys grow up to be cow boys. Well, I was one of those that I came out of college and I was fascinated by the recruitment function and I went to work for a head hunting agency and my mom was not a fan of it. She thought it was a waste of money. She had some choice words for me. She really wasn't a supporter. But I told her I'm going to prove you wrong. And the first year I did it, you know, almost got out of the industry. But after that I made some tweaks and the rest is history. I just love it and love making marriages happen. What can I say?

Mary Fain Brandt: 3:40

I love it. I love it. I love the energy that you bring, bez, and not only do you bring the knowledge and experience and the wisdom, but you bring a high energy and authenticity when we talk to you, and that's probably one of the things that I love is that you're just so authentic and real and I can talk to you for hours about anything from government contracts to LinkedIn to career stuff, but we don't have hours today, so I'm going to dive right in. And, bez, I know that you have three great points to discuss with us today, so let's break these down one by one. And why don't we get started with? When you submitted, like what you wanted to talk about? Bez wanted to. This is his statement. You guys, how about we start with why people should quit applying? Now, I know that's counter, that's counterintuitive. I'm looking for a job, but Bez is saying quit applying. So, guys, do you want to dive a little deeper into that?

Bez Rengifo: 4:43

Yeah, I think I put in quit applying and do this and I was thinking what should they do? And I actually know what you should do, but I thought the number one thing you should do is get out there, shake a few hands, kiss a few babies, but do not, do not punch a baby. You don't want to be a Will Ferrell, okay? So I don't know if you, if you catch that movie, but yeah, you want to get out of your seat and get out there, whether online or in IRL. But one of the things I always tell people is you know, when I look at my career journey, I have never gotten a job by applying.

Bez Rengifo: 5:24

In my 30 years in the industry. I have even my first job. I went to the career center, actually the school of business. I hit up the secretary. She said, oh yeah, we have this lead and you know what an alumni called in. They were looking for a recruiter and that I actually went to work for that company. And so you know, besides quit it, you know, don't apply is is the whole concept that there are other things you can do that are that you'll get a better return for your investment. Now, I'm not saying you can't get a job by applying.

Bez Rengifo: 6:01

We do have a lot of hires from applying, but there will come a point in your career where that doesn't work and because if you go on LinkedIn you'll see stories that say, hey, I've applied 200. There was one person who said I applied for 2,500 jobs in two months and nothing.

Mary Fain Brandt: 6:22

And.

Bez Rengifo: 6:22

I'm like how do you apply for 2,500 jobs? I mean, I really don't understand that. But it must be some speed applying site or something. But there's so many things that you can do that actually give you a greater return on your investment that I'd love to get into. But I don't know if you have any questions for me, but I'm ready to rock and roll.

Mary Fain Brandt: 6:43

Well, I just want to chime in that what you said at a certain stage in your career applying will not get you the job, because probably my last four corporate jobs that I had were one I was well, I was recruited for bishops. I was recruited for Francis Parker. I was recruited for Cal Private Bank. That was by my reputation, or, as we like to call it today, your personal brand, like who you are, what you're known for. And so I was recruited for all of those the last three corporate style positions that I had before I went out on my own, and that was literally from my network, from people knowing me from when I worked here. And then they moved and went to a different company. So my transition from Cal Western Law School in San Diego to the Bishop School was because three people from the law school went to bishops and then they were calling me are you ready to come over? I'm like, oh, maybe, let's talk about it. And so that's how I got that job. And then, from bishops, Francis Parker, they recruited me for a position that was the right, right position at the right time. And then Cal Private recruited me through a friend that worked there said I need a Mary, I need a Mary thing. And Sarah goes wait, my Mary thing. Wait, are you talking about? I know her.

Mary Fain Brandt: 8:06

And then on St Patty's Day I know I've told this story on St Patty's Day we do a big gathering, we go out it's a holiday for us, we don't work and she shows up with like a job description. I was like what's this? She goes oh, this is from Tom. I was like oh no, I was like this, this is our day. I'm not looking at that. I put that envelope down. Four days later the HR person called me and said hey, tom wanted to know if you had a chance to read the job description. I was like well, let's have a conversation. So it is at some point in your career. It's about who you know and getting out there.

Bez Rengifo: 8:44

And I'll just chime in there You're lucky you had a job description, because sometimes there is no job description right.

Bez Rengifo: 8:51

Because you are in the mix. You're out there, you're networking, you're talking to people, you're shaking a few hands, kissing a few babies and and, and you're in a conversation and ideas are flowing. They're and they're talking about an opportunity they want to take advantage of and they need the right person. And you happen to be in that conversation and voila, you end up being hired for that. That happens more than you think. In in corporate America it happens, and on the outside of the third party recruit. I've come to my clients and I've told them about a great person. They said that's exactly what we need. You don't know that we have this challenge in our company.

Bez Rengifo: 9:35

And it's a gap and that person's going to help us. And so they. I'll say well, do you want to see other people like no, no, no, that's the perfect person in the recruiting world. On the third party, we call that a people order.

Laura Bashore: 9:49

A what A?

Bez Rengifo: 9:49

people order A people order because we call them job orders. That's a people order, Right.

Laura Bashore: 9:56

Right, I love that and I think you know I was just at a networking event, hosting a networking event yesterday, and we were talking about how the majority of us were entrepreneurs now. But we wish that we had applied our networking skillset when we were in corporate. Just exactly to your point, bez, because you never know, you could be answering somebody's pain that they're having in their organization just by having a conversation. The light bulb sparks and they're like hey, we need to what people order, we need to put that people order in.

Mary Fain Brandt: 10:31

We need to place the people order right now with Bez.

Bez Rengifo: 10:34

Well, laura, many of us walk our, you know, go through our careers on that journey, like we just go where the wind blows. I'm guilty of that too. We get comfortable and we we sort of are at the whim of the organization. Now there's a better way, and it's just really simple Either you let your career manage you or you manage your career, and depending which approach.

Bez Rengifo: 11:00

If you go, if you're proactive and you manage your career, then you're planning your next three moves. You're walking into an interview and you're interviewing them. It's a whole different vibe, right. And now they're trying to, you know, see if they can meet your standards. And now, when you get hired, you know you're sitting, you're managing up, you're going to your boss and you're saying, hey, we're going to meet on a monthly basis, we're going to attract to your expectations. And where I'm at and because, why? Because you're there with intention. You've got some checkboxes to mark off, because you came there for a purpose, because after you get done with your checklist, you've got next.

Laura Bashore: 11:43

I love that, and I think this is really kind of leading right into the next thing that we wanted to discuss today, and it's something that's really not to be taken lightly. I think it's a game changer, but you need to be mindful about it, right? So get cracking jokes over here Sorry in my head. So you get what I said there, like you need to be working on your mindset. Why don't you talk to us a little bit about the power of mindset and career success?

Bez Rengifo: 12:14

You know, there was a time when I thought that you know, I was, you know, especially during the pandemic, I was going to just share all my interview tips with people and I would get in a room with them, you know, on social audio, and it was. They were defeated, they were. They would come in and I'm like, oh my goodness, you don't need interview tips, you need a mindset shift and there's a and some people I really couldn't help. I said you know, you may want to consider going talking to your provider and see where that leads you, because some people were. They had some stuff going on.

Bez Rengifo: 12:52

Mindset is extremely important. There is a lot of research around that and I'm not a psychologist, but I know what works for me, and what works for me does not work for the next person. So you know yourself better than anybody. You need to be. You know when you're at your best and you need to break that down and give you an example.

Bez Rengifo: 13:15

And a lot of times before an interview I tell people look, you have to, even if it's your own family member, put them on a timeout If they're not very, very positive and it's and it's affecting you, you need to distance yourself If you have friends like that, it's time to. Hey, I'm going to check out for the next few days Whatever it takes to get you in the right mindset. You know, eating well, staying on your schedule, going to sleep on time before that interview and then, when you wake up in the morning, have that routine, wake up with enough time so you don't feel stressed, and all the little things, even a tech check that could go wrong. All of these put you in the right mindset when you're in front of somebody, because the worst thing you can do is walk into a room and the vibe you're giving off says you don't belong in that room.

Mary Fain Brandt: 15:20

Yeah, I'm giggling, bez, because you said the tech check and you don't know because you weren't there at our last recording. But we did have some tech issues but we overcame those, right, laura.

Laura Bashore: 15:35

Yeah, I mean, I completely agree with what you're saying, like the more time you can give yourself, but also sometimes it's about expecting things might not go right, but then having confidence in yourself to know that you're gonna be able to fix it right, overcoming and push through it. So I think those are extremely important things to think about, because it's not all roses and sunshine all the time.

Mary Fain Brandt: 16:03

No, it's not, and it's really important to have that positive mindset. I started post or I posted, I'm not sure, because there's so many things going on but it was about we have a choice every day. We have a choice every day that it's gonna be a bad day or it's gonna be a good day. You might get up, let's just say you have two cats that are fighting and one starts getting sick and you're cleaning up after them, and I could go and say did?

Laura Bashore: 16:28

that just happen.

Mary Fain Brandt: 16:29

What's going on here? Yeah, so that just happened. So you might be, yeah, you might be going. I could say, oh my gosh, this is gonna ruin my entire day. Or I can be like they're cats I have pets. This is gonna happen. I'm gonna clean it up and I'm gonna get on with my day. So, being in control of your mind because we have so many thoughts that are coming through and we did this episode about 96,000 thoughts go through the person. You have 96,000 thoughts a day. 70% are negative. Take control of that and if you see yourself turning and going down that negative mindset, just flip the switch, come back and say you know what? That doesn't dictate my day, my week, my life, my year. That is a moment.

Bez Rengifo: 17:17

And Mary, I used to think exactly like you. I'm a positive person, I have a choice to be happy. But there are people out there that they're a little bit chemically imbalanced and it's not like that where they turn on a switch right, they have to take medication, they have-.

Mary Fain Brandt: 17:33

Yeah, this is true.

Bez Rengifo: 17:34

And so I'm a little bit sensitive to that, because I know everybody's not like me, cause I've run across those people saying just come on, just turn it around, get your mind in the right place, and you try to pump them up and it doesn't resonate with them.

Bez Rengifo: 17:51

So that's why I say whatever works for you they've given you to get you to that place, because I've talked to people that it's hard for them to get. Maybe they might suffer from depression and what works for them is breathing exercises. Right, because the anxiety really gets to them and an interview is a very anxious. It's an anxious event, right For even us who are pretty positive. Where for us it'll make us sharper, for another person boy it's really hard to get over that hump.

Mary Fain Brandt: 18:25

So let's move on to the next topic, which is probably, I feel and I think Laura feels this way one of the most important and often overlooked. As you mentioned or touched on earlier that people just think things are gonna fall in place. I show up every day, I'm gonna get a promotion. I apply, I'm gonna get an interview right. Here's a little analogy A captain without a course will sail around and around the ocean and most likely will not reach his destination. The same thing applies to your career. So my question is are you on a career ship without a course, sailing around and around and shameless? Plug that. If you need some guidance, some direction, a strategy and accountability, laura and I have created three caffeinated career packages just for our audience, and links to all of that will be in the show notes. So let's talk about career planning, what it is and why you need to do it, so that you're not like that captain on that ship just spinning around and around and around. Laura, do you Bez? Who wants to take this?

Bez Rengifo: 19:37

Ladies first.

Laura Bashore: 19:39

Oh, okay. Well, I think Bez alluded to this a little bit earlier when we were talking too, which is that you can either let someone else dictate what's happening to you. I think a lot of times we believe that if we show up, people are gonna recognize what we do. I know Hopefully my husband's okay with me sharing this but you know, that's kind of how his career went before he had his own, his own business, which is that he would come and be frustrated because he would say I don't understand. Other people are getting the pay increases or promotion that I want, but I'm the one who's showing up every single day. I don't miss work and you know, I'm the one who just will step up and do whatever's asked of me, or do it even before it's asked. And and it's a little bit more than that right buzz like controlling your career you have to do Different strategies, so do you want to share some of those with us?

Bez Rengifo: 20:42

Yeah, I'm gonna take a step back to that, because before you do career plank, you actually should do life planning, and Life planning actually has career planning nested in it, right? So you know you, you get out of school or whatever, and many of us don't, you know they, we don't even do it early in our career, we do it later, right.

Bez Rengifo: 21:05

But if you do it when you, when you're in school and about to graduate, the best thing you could do is sit down and map out your whole life, I mean the next 30 plus years. You know, and you're not gonna have all the answers, but you might know what you might want to do in the next five years, right and, and why you should do life planning, because you might say, well, I might want to get married, I want to do this. Oh, what happens if I have kids?

Bez Rengifo: 21:32

There's a lot of life events that sometimes we don't think of, that actually have an impact about how our career journey sort of progresses and we have to give our space, our Self space and grace for that, because life is not linear, you know, it's not perfect. We all got stuff and we have to account for that. So I do the one of the things I'll tell people is designed to lie that you want to live in the Pace, that you want to live right. Because you've mentioned a few things, laura, you know, you, you, you show up to work every day. Some of us work overtime or late into the night, thinking that's going to Really put us out there as that person to promote right.

Bez Rengifo: 22:22

Yeah and and and what happens when we don't get it? It's it we. It defeats us, right, because we put our life into that, into the organization we give so much of ourself. And you know what our family's over here on the side. We're coming home late, we're not seeing the kids as much as we should, we're not showing up to their. You know Soccer, baseball games, you know and you know what it should be. The opposite, right, because you know. But it depends how you want to show up, how do you want to design your life. So design your life as much as you can, revisit it every year, and that's a whole immersive experience. We won't get into the details here, but now getting into your career, Career planning yeah, right now.

Bez Rengifo: 23:07

With that, with both together, you can now start mapping things out. And, you know, do your research, go to a governmental agency websites that give you a statistics on titles, compensation, and there's other websites out there that can do that. Do the research and always tell people, because I'm right now dealing with a lot of friends and I'm just helping them out. They're at director, vp, c-suite level and I asked them you know, let's plan out the third position into the future. And they look at me like, why that? And I go well, what is it, what is the title and what are you gonna be doing? And sometimes they don't have the answer and that's okay. So they go and do that exercise. Then I say, once you do the third position out, then you're able to come back and you'll know what the second one's gonna look like, because the third one out there gave you some guidance.

Bez Rengifo: 24:09

Now, when you go back and do the next spot you need to, that you want to go to, you definitely know how that looks and now you have your roadmap. So this right here is critical, because when you show up to an interview we had just talked about this you have some questions to ask. You're interviewing them as much as they're interviewing you. You're deciding whether this is the right spot for you because you know what you're going in there with intention and when you get hired, you talk different, you move different and the hiring managers or your lead, they know, they know that you're there for her. You don't have to tell them because you're moving a certain way and so you're gonna see things like they're gonna advocate for you because you're showing up, you're setting you're not waiting for them to set that monthly one-on-one. You're setting it up for the next 12 months and you're showing up.

Mary Fain Brandt: 25:02

I think, that's a good point that you need to take the initiative, and when we're talking about career planning, you need to be having those quarterly meetings with your boss. Are you on track? Are you hitting your numbers? Whatever that is, are you performing the job and are you going above and beyond? Are you adding new things? But I also think it's really important, as you said, baz, is that I call it the three-year plan. What is your next step? Like it might be to get a promotion, or your next step might be I wanna learn everything I can about sales here and then I wanna go somewhere else, right? So I think it's important to have those three-year plans, five-year plans and, laura, what do you have to say about that career path and the strategy on planning?

Laura Bashore: 25:50

Yeah, well, I think combining. Sometimes, when we hear that question asked of us in the interviews, if someone says, what do you wanna do in the next five years, I used to hate that question, right, I used to hate that question, though I used to think like, well, how am I supposed to know that? But to the points that you guys are saying is figure out what you want so that you can start reverse engineering, and that's how you know what you're gonna be going into those conversations with your immediate supervisor about and that's how you know, well, what can I get out of the position or the company where I am, because it is a give and take and while you might not be looking at ending your career there, you definitely wanna make sure that the time you're there is valued, and that's by knowing where you wanna go. So I think great points that you guys are gonna share.

Bez Rengifo: 26:41

So, laura, that your time there is valued is super. It's a very important thought you just released into the world.

Mary Fain Brandt: 26:51

So let's end with our very fun random rapid questions, bez. These are yes or no. There's no, maybe. There's no pink. There's no blue. Your answer must be yes or no. Do we understand the rules, bez?

Bez Rengifo: 27:06

I understand the assignment.

Mary Fain Brandt: 27:09

I love it. It's very short and sweet. Okay, here we go. Open to work. Banner on LinkedIn on your profile photo. Yes or no?

Bez Rengifo: 27:19

Say that again. I'm sorry.

Mary Fain Brandt: 27:20

Okay, the open to work banner on your profile photo on LinkedIn yes or no?

Bez Rengifo: 27:27

Yes.

Mary Fain Brandt: 27:28

Okay.

Bez Rengifo: 27:30

Not me, but for others.

Mary Fain Brandt: 27:32

The answer is yes or no. There's Bez coloring outside the lanes again.

Bez Rengifo: 27:37

I love.

Mary Fain Brandt: 27:38

Bez. Okay, yes, apply directly on LinkedIn or on company website LinkedIn or company website Neither, neither.

Bez Rengifo: 27:47

Okay, I'm gonna let you have that one.

Mary Fain Brandt: 27:50

Oh yeah, Thank you. Notes yes or no.

Bez Rengifo: 27:53

Absolutely.

Mary Fain Brandt: 27:55

Finally coffee or tea.

Bez Rengifo: 27:58

Decaf coffee for me, okay.

Mary Fain Brandt: 28:02

Mountains or ocean, both.

Bez Rengifo: 28:06

Ocean, ocean.

Laura Bashore: 28:06

Okay, okay, all right Bez the colors outside of the lanes, and that's okay.

Mary Fain Brandt: 28:12

We still love you, bez. I'm not a staying your lane type of guy.

Bez Rengifo: 28:18

So I don't know why sorry.

Laura Bashore: 28:22

That's okay, we're good, we're good.

Mary Fain Brandt: 28:28

Thank you, bez, for sharing your valuable insights and practical advice to us. And practical advice. Today. We wanna encourage listeners to connect with Bez online on LinkedIn. We will drop his LinkedIn URL in the show notes and we just wanna, laura and I, just wanna say thank you to all of our listeners to this first leg of the podcast journey, getting it up and running and being consistent, knowing that we are helping people think about their careers, create strategies and to help them with their mindset, resumes, linkedin branding. We're just excited to be part of this journey with you, and if you have a topic that you really wanna hear us discuss, please drop us a note and we might weave it into the next season. If you enjoyed the podcast, show us some love. Please rate, review and subscribe to our podcast, and if you have any feedback, go ahead and share that with us too, because we wanna hear from you.

Laura Bashore: 29:28

And don't forget to visit our website. We define your career journey that can help you take the next step in your career.

Mary Fain Brandt: 29:34

Woohoo, we'll see you next week with another episode was to help you redefine your career journey. Until then, stay focused, stay motivated and stay caffeinated.